Rewiring...

[lsanderson]

At one point, when I put up the run of salvage track lighting up in the kitchen it worked fine with a fluorescent light each on it's own switch. At some point, a certain Asian fixed them, and instead of two switches controlling two different light systems, there's been two switches controlling the lights. I'm trying to separate them again, and it's proving much more complicated than I imagined. My simple plan A got the fluorescent back on the switch, but oddly enough the tracks won't light. Being such a wizard of wiring, this shouts out: "Something's not right." Of course, my usual hint that something's not right is when I throw the circuit breaker and it goes off immediately.

Comments

[dd-b.livejournal.com]

Going from a three-way back to separate? I'm not sure I understood the description of the recent starting point accurately.

The books give two ways of wiring three-way switches, the way I learned in grade school and another strange one, which I've found actually used in professional wiring; if you were expecting the simple one, that may be what's confusing things. (The alternative way doesn't work with X-10 three-way switches, so I had to convert it to the normal wiring for three-ways).

Perhaps the Asian in question could be compelled to explain what he'd done?

Too complex...

[lsanderson.livejournal.com]

It's just two switches and two lights. It's all the wires in between that complicate matters. No three-way switches.

Re: Too complex...

[lsanderson.livejournal.com]

The switches just got wired in series... they work that way, but not well.

A stab in the dark

[mle292.livejournal.com]

I'm guessing without actually seeing it. I am assuming that nothing in the box with the light fixture has been changed or been opened since it's been modified.

I think that a jumper wire probably got removed in the last modification. You might need to take two short pieces of wire and connect them with a wire nut to one hot so that you'll have two hot wires, one for the "in" of each switch.

Again, I haven't actually seen it, so I'm guessing.

If this doesn't fit what you've got, describe how many wires are in all of the boxes that have been opened, if they're in a cable with other wires and how many total are in that cable ("one cable with a black, white and red from the top, two cables with a black and white each from the bottom" is good). If you can't tell what color the wires used to be, don't worry about it, just give as much information as you can.

Re: A stab in the dark

[mle292.livejournal.com]

The top picture is what you WANT. The bottom picture is what I think you have.

The green wire is the jumper that I think is missing. Do not use green wire for that jumper, use black or red, I only used a green marker because that was what was next to the computer.

Re: A stab in the dark

[lsanderson.livejournal.com]

Si, only there's no light between the two switches, and the power is coming in from ghod knows where in older wiring. Somebody "simplified" it, and I don't remember how I wired the track lighting in any longer. There's only six wires, so there's not that many possible combinations, right?

Re: A stab in the dark

[mle292.livejournal.com]

Edited to make more sense.

I think I'm getting warmer. In the second drawing, the two switches are physically in the same location, the light is only electrically between the switches because the wiring travels up and back.

There are only three boxes in my assumption. One with two switches, one with one light fixture and one with the other light fixture. The romexes each go to one light fixture, the old wires are the power in.

The two old wires are the power in. One is a hot and one is a neutral.

So, to make it right, connect all three neutral wires under one wire nut together first, then the rest will probably make sense. Those three neutral wires do not connect to any of the switches. One neutral wire from the panel box (old wire), one from one light box down to the switch box (the white from one romex), one from the other light down to the switch box(the white from the other romex).

That connection is the dot on the right side of the top drawing.

After the neutrals are all connected, connect two short pieces of wire to the other non-neutral wire from the old wiring. connect one of each of those to one screw on each switch.

Then, connect the two remaining black wires (one from each romex) to the other screw on each switch.

I'll make a drawing of what I'm trying to say in the morning if that doesn't make sense.

Re: A stab in the dark

[lsanderson.livejournal.com]

Yes but...

Can't do colors 'cause one B, W, & G romex does down to the switches and I'm splitting it for the two switches. So, one white is hot.

The original hot & ground are up in the ceiling -- orange & white that's faded to yellow.

It should all be simple this morning... I'm about to throw the switch.

Re: A stab in the dark

[mle292.livejournal.com]

Can't do colors 'cause one B, W, & G romex does down to the switches and I'm splitting it for the two switches. So, one white is hot.

The hot white is a switch loop, for when the power starts in the ceiling. There is probably no neutral wire to the switch box.

I'll guess that you've probably already got it. The important thing to remember is to have a neutral wire for everything that consumes power (switches do not consume power, light bulbs do).

So that the colors make sense, here's a drawing of a typical switch loop with only one switch, power starts in the ceiling.

Re: A stab in the dark

[lsanderson.livejournal.com]

I did the jumper bit, but guessed at the wrong romex in the ceiling, which, inexplicably worked anyway. I've got two old wires coming in and two new romex. Have to make another stab at it in the light tomorrow.

It just looks as if it should be simple, but the house was originally lighted with gas, not electric, and things get kinda weird faster than you'd think. It all made sense when I wired it the last time, I just don't understand how it got so messed up.